Without question, this is the post I have looked forward to least in this series. What’s more, it will have to be a two-parter. So I’ll jump in with both feet, get it out of the way early, and let the conversation unfold as it wills. I thought it important to deal with the marriage question first to establish that what may be permissible for the single woman can be problematic for the married woman. We have the Scriptures from the preceding post to verify the point.
I wanted to deal with this issue strictly from the standpoint of the married mother, since that is largely where the controversy lies. For those who embrace the stay at home daughter trend, I offer no opinion either way, except to say that openness to whatever the will of the Lord might be must trump current theological fads and trends. If your family feels God has led you in this direction, then follow that path. My own husband has expressed the sentiment of welcoming our daughters to remain with us until they marry. In the end, however, we feel that they must be free to follow God and not us. It is our job to provide the loving guidance they require.
Even a cursory glance of Scripture dispels the notion the notion that the single woman is called to the same domestic centered life of the married woman. There is the most famous Biblical example, Ruth, who had to go out each day and glean so that she and Naomi could eat. Ruth was clearly a godly woman, yet she felt free to follow Naomi to this strange land and live with her in a home without male leadership. Ruth is a particularly relevant example given that 40% of children in America are born to fatherless homes, and of those who are born to intact families, many will enter adulthood the products of fatherless homes. The implications of these trends are clear. There are many young women who love God and have to support themselves somehow.
Even more relevant however, is Phoebe, whom Paul sent on a missionary journey to Rome. Whether or not she was accompanied by a husband, the Scripture doesn’t say, but she was clearly the emissary Paul chose to represent his interests to the Roman church. And of course, there is the Scripture that we have highlighted before in 1 Corinthians 7, where the freedom to serve the Lord without distraction is offered as a blessing and a benefit to both women and men. Our daughter has asked if she can get a summer job as she will soon be 16 and legally permitted to do so. We have given our consent provided she is a good steward of what she earns (tithing, saving, wise purchases) and the job and hours are compatible with the dynamic of our family life. I learned valuable lessons about the value of a dollar and managing money as a 15-year-old because of my first job, at a daycare center a block from my home. It was also this experience that began to shape my ideas about the roles of wives and mothers, before I was ever concerned with the subject of Biblical womanhood.
Often we get into fruitless debates because we start out asking the wrong questions. Because we live in a world that is far from ideal, because many if not most newlyweds enter marriages with massive amounts of debt, usually college debt, and because the culture has long abandoned the truth of God’s word concerning the value of a woman keeping the home, I want to ask a different question. Rather than ask if it is God’s desire that women work, a question to which I find no definitive Scriptural answer that would apply to every woman, I would ask a different question:
Is it the will of God for His people to hire out the raising of our children to total strangers whose values may or may not be in keeping with those in His word? This is a question I believe we can find definitive Scriptural answers for.
I have spent a considerable amount of mental energy looking for a way to broach this subject apart from the oft-repeated Scripture passage in Titus 2, used as the catch-all mandate to demand that all women are called to be homemakers. There can be little doubt that much of what ails society increased sharply in response to women leaving the home and entering the workforce in masses. Divorce rates skyrocketed, illegitimacy increased exponentially, and the trend of perpetual adolescence is accepted as a normal part of development. Psychiatrists have deemed this a biological certainty despite the fact that it is a fairly new trend. This passage in Romans 1 often springs to mind when I consider the culture in which we live, one where the promise of perfect egalitarianism has wrought a moral free for all, where anything is possible, everything is permissible, and our children are more lost than they have ever been:
For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools, and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man…(Romans 1:20-23a)
Before I delve into the possible Scriptural justification a wife might have for working outside of her home, and there are a few, I want to address the issue in light of the question asked above for the consideration of those women who work for personal fulfillment or a more comfortable lifestyle, because I believe that this group encompasses a large portion of working wives and mothers, even in the church. I know this is true because I am constantly confronted with the objections of Christian women to the role of homemaker for reasons that have little to do with financial hardship. I want to wrap up this portion of the discussion with a few verses of Scripture concerning our God-ordained responsibility to our children, which is completely incompatible with leaving them in a facility during their youngest and most formative years with people we have little in common with and with whom we have very little real insight about what they believe and/or are capable of.
Only take heed to yourself, and diligently keep yourself, lest you forget the things your eyes have seen, and lest they depart from your heart all the days of your life. And teach them to your children and your grandchildren. Deuteronomy 4:9
And these words which I command you today shall be in your heart. You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, when you walk by the way, when you lie down, and when you rise up. You shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes. You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates. Deuteronomy 6:6-9
Train a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not turn from it. Proverbs 22:6
The rod and rebuke give wisdom, But a child left to himself brings shame to his mother. Proverbs 29:16
Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right. “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise: “that it may be well with you and you may live long on the earth.”And you, fathers, do not provoke your children to wrath, but bring them up in the training and admonition of the Lord. Ephesians 6:1-4
Clearly God takes the proper care and training of the children He has blessed us with quite seriously. He has given the responsibility to us. And yes, I noted that in the last Scripture passage the fathers have a job to do as well. Wives, however, are specifically called to keep (translated guard) the home and I submit that we should have very good and Scripturally sound reasons for abdicating our posts to enter the workforce.
In part 2,we’ll consider some of those possible reasons. 
I think part of the problem is that the nature of our work is different today. Until recently, many women were able to work from home, producing things in the home, for example, or working alongside a husband on the farm. Most of our work now is out, in the marketplace itself, requiring us to leave our children to the care of others. There are work-at-home jobs and there are things one can do at home to earn money on the side, but they tend to be hard to come by and/or not very lucrative for most women. (At least in my experience!)
Personally, I think it is a tragedy when a woman *chooses* to leave her children to increase her lifestyle, to have more “toys”. It is also a tragedy when a woman *must* leave her family to put food on the table.
Most of this is pretty good. In fact the only thing that really irked me was your husband thinking the decision of whether your daughters stay at home until they are married is his to make. It’s not. It’s your daughters choice between her and the Lord. The Bible says for children to obey their parents, it doesn’t tell adults to obey their parents. Once daughters are 18, it’s between them and the Lord and them and the Lord only. Their decision. It isn’t one your husband has any right or Biblical backing to make himself.
However, I tend to think you’d be a bit more balanced than that from what I’ve read here lately. I was concerned for a while but so far I like what you’ve had to say in this series.
Yes, aussiemama, it is between my daughters and the Lord, and I apologize for not making myself more clear. It should have read that my husband has said he is open to our girls remaining with us through their younger adult years or until marriage, not having them feel pressured to leave because that is what all the other young women their age might be doing. I have edited the post to read the more closely tothe way it should have initially. Thank you for pointing that out to me.
Frankly, neither he nor I fancies the idea of a grown woman whom God`may not have called into marriage living with us indefinitely. Full grown adults need the responsibility and the freedom, whether married or not, to manage their own households.
Hi, Jodi, and thanks for commenting!
Here’s the thing: I realize that there are women who *must* go out and leave their children to the care of others. I question whether it should be the norm as it is today, particularly in the body of Christ.
You’re right that the nature of work has changed, but much of this is largely due to the feminist movement, which I believe the church should resist at every turn. These women were very vocal about their hostility to family life. I posted about some the early feminists here. In fact, even as the country became more industrialized, women were largely homemakers or entrpeneurs (ironing, sewing, cleaning houses etc. in the case of black women who have never known what it is NOT to work).
As such, wages for men were set in a way that maintaining a household on one income was possible. When the two-income household began to rise, the cost of living asjusted accordingly, and with it came the rise of the very expensive and very risky industry of third party childcare. These trends are not some random happening, but were clearly the plan for many at the outset of the feminist movement.
If just the Christian community alone, would, as much as possible begin to reject the culture’s insistence that this is simply the nature of things now, and those wives who can go home would (even if things are tight, and believe me I know a lot about that), things would start to change. As believers, we are supposed to be counter-cultural.
Maybe if all the Christian wives weren’t at work, we would be available (those who could stand it, lol) to provide childcare for our Christian sisters who *must* go to work temporarily to get out of debt and get settled enough financially to come home.
These things are all related and at the very least, I believe Christians should refuse to accept the world’s way of doing things without ever questioning if God has a better way for us, you know?
Because I have seen up close and personal in my own family and community where this trend will ultimately lead (black illegitimacy is 70% at this writing), I am passionate about this. I would implore believers to think outside the box so that we would not be a party to the hastening of our country’s demise.
Oh, I agree completely. I don’t think it should be the norm at all. I think what’s sad is that a lot of Christian women don’t *want* to be home. Many would rather use the have-to-provide-food excuse. (Yes, there are some who truly *do*have to work to be able to eat, but I’d say not the majority in today’s society.)
Honestly, some of the nastiest fights I’ve seen about this topic are among Christian sisters. I had a pastor’s wife tell me all she did at home was “change diapers and fill juice cups.” That attitude is purely a result of feminism, in my opinion. As a SAHM, I felt pretty demeaned by that, but sorry for her that she took no joy or saw no purpose in what she did.
This is an interesting topic; I look forward to reading more!
Terry, thanks for the clarification, that makes so much more sense for what I know of you.
Not to sound contriversial on this topic but I am hesitant to agree with the whole once a child is 18 they are an adult.. By whose statutes??? Is it okay to say that because the societal norm and man places an age cap of 18 as an adult that we then release our children away from us? Yes they may be technically an adult to pay taxes and assume ridiculous fiduciary responsibilities, but if you research the bible there really isn’t an age distinction between a child, and an adult. Yes we are to obey the laws of the land, but what if God shows us that it is his will for us to keep our children home for a few more years? Who do we obey?? I honestly believe that if you are walking circumspectly with God, if this matter comes up then He will work the situation out to where the child will see and understand that remaining at home is best for them. I believe he gives us wisdom as parents to guide our children into the light and mandates that he orders us.
not disputing what was said, but just wanting to hear other thoughts on the age issue… I will always be my mother’s child and even though I am an adult married with children there are areas where I still obey her. When I go to her house I obey her rules, when she asks me to do something for her I don’t do her a favor, I obey her. I teach my children her rules and obedience to her because as her child that is my responsibility. If she leaves me her credit card and says buy the children thus and such, then I obey. Not out of respect only but because I am still her child and I still have to obey her when the circumstance presents itself….. just a humble thought.
Terry,
I’m reading along although not necessarily able to keep up with the comments.
However, I would agree with what Jamala said about adults at 18. Remember I have one.
I’m constantly reminding him that he is an adult. But also he is still accountable to letting us know where he is and what time to expect him, etc.
Anyway, I had come to the conclusion that college was a dangerous place years ago, but one of the reasons I arrived at that was due to the lack of accountability. I don’t think it is wise for anyone, young or old, to be unaccountable to others. When a young person goes off to college or has their own apt. There is no one to hold them accountable but themselves. Not wise!
Even in some ways my children hold me accountable. “Mom, you were on the phone for an hour!”, “What’s for supper?”, etc.
The turning loose at a magical age seems to be a purely American, or Western, idea. Definitely not Biblical. (Although don’t mix me up with the extremes!)
Berean Wife
As a couple before we bought our first home, we decided to buy based on my husband’s income instead of both of ours so that I could stay home with our children. Both of us are happy with that decision. However, we are now at a point where the kids are in school full time (obviously only during the school year), and I am very much at loose ends during the day. I am committed to being home in the mornings and afternoons when the children are at home, but don’t see a problem with getting part time work while they are at school. My husband supports, and even encourages, this idea. Your thoughts?
@ Jamala and Berean Wife,
I agree with you two as well as Aussiemama. I do not believe in the magical age of 18 as an automatic transfer to adulthood.
When I talked about full grown adults managing their own households (emphasis on “full grown”), I was referring to young women 25 or 30 years old, as yet unmarried, being asked to live according to the rules of my home when they are fully capable of managing their own homes.
I think Aussiemama was saying that at 18, if they chose to leave, legally, there is nothing we could do to keep them here, not that we should encourage them to leave. I know that this is true because I know two families where their daughters did just that, breaking their parents’ heart.
In one case, because the daughter was still a high school student, the parents called the police (classifing her a runaway) and were told there was nothing they could do since she was of legal age and couldn’t be considered a runaway.
As for college, we are not at all proponents of packing up our children up and sending them off to college. If our children attend college, they will do so while living at home. Unless, they decide to go their own way and pay their own way.
And here I thought the most controversial part of the post was my condemnation of day care, lol!
My mom did it, and it worked out pretty good. Of course, once we were teens, she took on full time work, leaving us alone for several hours after school since we didn’t “need” her, and we got into all kinds of mischief, some of it very serious.
I didn’t do it when my older kids were in school because I wanted to be intricately involved with what went on and school, which meant spending time there a couple of days per week. And boy am I glad I did! I learned a lot and was able to fight plenty of battles, turning back things that would have been harmful to my kids and everyone else’s, and also having the principal’s ear because of my investment of time.
Of course, that was 10 years ago when parents still had a measure of influence. I am seeing that eroding. But I would ask you to consider that perspective also.
If you really need the money, maybe substituting AT their school a couple of days per week?
You knew you would be hearing from me on this subject….
You said “Is it the will of God for His people to hire out the raising of our children to total strangers whose values may or may not be in keeping with those in His word? ”
And I would agree that it is not, but the problem with the Christian mom blogsphere is that many see only two types of moms: the SAHM and the career woman who has her child(ren) in daycare 50+ hours a week.
I am hardly letting someone else raise my child (unless you count my husband–he does spend a fair amount of time with our daughter), and I have much more in common with a SAHM than a person working in the corporate world, yet it doesn’t seem to matter if a mom is working 6 hours a week or 60, the condemnation is the same.
Nurse Bee,
I do realize the difference between the mother who works part time (such as yourself) and the mother who works full time.
Unfortunately, I don’t know many part time working mothers. Almost all are full time.
About the daycare issue….
We had a young couple in our small group last year. They’d been married less than a year and were expecting their first child. The mom had recently graduated from college, and many of her prayer requests were about finding good child care for the baby. She shared that she didn’t need to work necessarily for financial reasons, but since she’d just put all that time and $$ into her degree and passed her boards, etc., it seemed like a big ‘waste’ not to put it to use. They had a darling baby girl, and tried several in-home day care situations that didn’t work out after Mom went to work and this was a big source of stress for them. It really pained me to see them taking this beautiful baby girl from virtual stranger to stranger. One of the other small group moms – a homeschooler – eventually offered to watch the baby for a couple of months until Mom could find a better arrangement. As we homeschool too I probably could have done the same thing – and I thought about it a lot – but I guess it just bothered me to think I would be in some way supporting their decision to work and not stay home with an infant. They’ve since moved to another state, but I still think about this sometimes with some guilt pangs and wonder if it is right or wrong for Christian SAHMs to care for other working mom’s children if there’s not a clear financial need for Mom to be working.
In that same vein the other thing I question is churches with onsite daycares for children as young as 6 weeks. I’m guessing they feel they’re providing a valuable ministry and in certain situations it may be a godsend for some, but I wonder about the message it sends.
I have breathed sighs of relief and prayers of thanksgiving that my husband and I lived to see our children grown, they are 19 and 22, and that I never had to work full time or put them in day care.
Though I hands down believe a two parent family with mom staying home is best and most closely aligns itself with Biblical womanhood as outlined by scripture (for the married woman with children), there is a shade of gray in this topic and I’ve lived in it and want to extend a heart of compassion to anyone like my mother, widowed at 39, (I was 11 when I lost my father) who finds herself without a choice in the matter.
My mother, a nurse, just about stood on her and my head simultaneously when I told her I was quitting work. I was 23 and pregnant with my first child. She had her reasons and they were more to do with practicality than feminism, though she did have a wide swath of the latter in her. Not only did I choose to defy convention of the late ’80s by abandoning my career, I had to overcome her and my financial fear, fear of being widowed, understandable fears for both of us.
Considering where I’d come from, it was a true step of faith to come home full-time, and I am grateful to say the Lord gave me the desires of my heart.
My anthem now is “no regrets!”
My husband grew up in a typical ’50s family, loved it, supported my decision and has not, since our children are grown, pushed me to seek employment outside the home. He calls the work of stay at home moms and wives “an honorable profession.” Oh for more men like him!
I thought I would not comment on this post but I now feel led to weigh in. I agree with Aussiemama and Terry here. Once a child is an adult they do have the right to make their own decisions. This in a way ties into comments from the last post on teen-age marriage. For most people sometime between the ages of 16/17 – 21ish they become fully able to take care of themselves. It is different for each individual. As parents our job is to instill sound values and morals in our children while we are raising them so that by the time they are adults they are capable of making sound decisions. If we have not done that and our children are making decisions we do not agree with after age 18 then we must step back. We can not live in the U.S. and ignore it’s laws. The law of our land states that at 18 our children are adults with the rights of adults and we are not legally able to take that away from them. Therefore we must be busy now to do what we can to prepare them to be godly young men and women.
Further from a biblical standpoint our adult children are not told to obey us but to honor us, there is difference. We are to obey the Lord but our parents may or may not be following the Lord and we are not called to obey them. I know many a homeschool family who would not be homeschooling if the adult parents had to obey their own parents, my family included!!!
We must learn to stand back and allow our adult children to listen to the voice of their Savior and follow His lead for their lives. We can not continue to assume that we know what His will is for them. Now if they are still living in our home and financially dependent on us we can set “house rules” like we would for anyone, adult or child, staying in our home. But to say that we can physically force an adult child to stay in our homes and follow our plans for their lives is not biblical and borders on abusive in my opinion.
Our oldest daughter is in high school and plans to go to college. My husband and I have invested countless hours educating her on all the ways she can go about obtaining her degree. She has prayerfully decided with our input and guidance that staying home is the best course of action for her. However I view this as a joint decision between she and us with both sides seeking guidance from the Lord. When I discuss her plans I am open to listening and I don’t seek to “lay down the law.” We talk to her like the sensible young woman she is and she rises to the occasion and generally we come to the same conclusion.
Good point Nurse Bee! I know many a sahm who spends so much time on the phone, volunteering, serving in the church, shopping, and on the internet, that they are actually giving their children less time than a mother working a few hours per week and putting her child in the care of a father or grandparent.
We do need to move away from blanket statements and judgments about right and wrong and allow each family to be guided by the Holy Spirit for their specific situation.
Mrs. Henderson,
I just wanted to state that I do agree with you, Terry and Aussiemama and don’t believe in going against the laws of the land. I really couldn’t type much and elaborate the way I wanted to on the subject of the age of adulthood.
It burdens my heart to hear some parents say ” when my child turns 18 then they are grown and have to leave my house” I have known some of those same 18 yrs olds to be terrified and clueless as to what they are supposed to do so they either work, attend school, or join the miliary or worse, they bum around with other 18yr olds who are like them un-prepared for the real world.
As a Christian, I do believe that if God showed me one of my children were not ready for the world, then with careful prayer and communication he can bless me to help my child see the benefits of staying close to me so that I can help prepare them more.
Case in point, I have a mentally handicapped sister who is 33 yrs old. She functions socially and mentally at the age of a 13-14 yr old. My mother ( who didn’t really know at the time) placed her in an adult assisted living facility at the time because she felt it would be the best thing for her, but we quickly saw that it wasn’t as all they did was place her on so many meds for behavior that it really regressed her instead of progressing her independence. Now my mom retired early and brought her home full time to do what she sees she should have done yrs ago, teach and take care of her child. But the government said she was legally an adult and without her being in an assisted facility there were not many programs out there for her. I know her case is different, but she had other classmates who were maybe a few levels higher than she who went out into the real world only to find out the hard way that this world is a cruel cruel place.
That’s why I said that God can give us wisdom on what’s best for our children and we don’t have to stamp “grown” on them just because they turn 18… But they are adults then and if they want to leave and pursue thier hearts desire then all I can do is pray over them and take confidence that I have done what God has told me in preparing them. But if they want to stay home then I welcome them with open arms… Thats more or less what I was trying to say. Not that we must keep them locked up until we feel they are ready, but I do believe that there are some who at 18 just are not ready and because society puts so much social pressure on letting them fly away at 18 then most people send them out and with the past couple of generations ( mine included) it is so evident that many of the adults running around here are no where prepared for adult responsibilities that this world places on them….
Oh one more thing, ( I promise I’m not upset or trying to be stand-offish)
but I find it hard to believe that since I believe that I am honoring my mom by being obedient to her requests as an adult that it is found to be contradictory to scripture…. Not trying to pat myself on the back but I think it’s cool that I don’t have a problem being obedient to the things my parents request of me. To me that means they instilled that deep seed of honor and respect and because I love God and them I am not to grown to do the things they may ask as they would never ask me to do anything that would require me to not honor my marriage vows or anything that lessens the fact that I am an adult.
I would never tell my adult child they have to do something for me, but I would hope that if I request something of them they would still honor me enough to want to do it for me as long as it doesn’t cross the word of God. Maybe I am looking at it wrong and if I am then I am open to that also….
Maybe I misunderstood but is it a bad thing for an adult to still obey their parents since Scripture tells us Children obey your parents, and to Honor thy father and mother?? Are we not following scripture if we do both?
Again, I hope I don’t sound hurt or upset or anything because I am not, I just wanted to know and I do look to you ladies somewhat as the wise generation! LOL
Jamala it sounds like you and I are in agreement. The thing I think many parents miss is that the work involved in having a strong influence on adult children is done while they are minors, not once they become adults. It is a slow and gradual process of developing a strong relationship, raising them to know and love their Savior and to value and honor the opinions of their parents. When we raise wise children they will, upon adulthood, honor the opinions of their parents and seek the Lord first in everything. That I believe is the key. A wise person knows their limitations. If however they get to be adults and are not wise we may be in a situation where we must let them go.
There is a part of my daughter who would love to go away to a Christian university and live in the dorms. But she is a wise young woman and she realizes that she will still need the protection of her father and I when she is 18. She knows that her freedom to devote herself to her studies will be enhanced by not having to worry about living on her own. However if we had not instilled certain things in her from birth she may be a totally different person from who she is today. Praise God for leading us in the right way to raise her!! It is such a blessing it is to have a godly, God-honoring teenage daughter!!!
Okay Terry, on to my thoughts about your question. I do not believe that it is the will of God for us to hire people to raise or help raise our children….
Now, with that being said because some of us at one point in our lives either because we did not know, or our sinful nature led us away from the word of God made very foolish decisions and did not acknowledge him in all our ways. We are not as scripture tells us being buffeted about for our own faults and we must take it patiently. While we are patiently taking our buffeting we have to work and hand off our children to others against our hearts desires. And yes, it is a struggle to sit at a desk for 8hrs a day and wonder if someone is treating your child they way you would. Wonder, if your child is feeling loved at all moments of your absence. It is a very difficult thing to do and even more difficult when you come to the light that it is so much more of a bigger calling for you to be at home with your little ones than to be at work away from them.
Now about the patiently accepting the buffet… I believe during this time you should redirect your line of thinking to always, always acknowledging God, you should pray for him to guide you through correcting those finacial mistakes you made, and ask Him to help teach you how to be the stewart of the time and money you are making presently so that in the very near future you can return home to your children. It doesn’t matter how old they are THEY STILL NEED YOU! As you stated before, when your mom worked full time when you became a teenager you got into more sticky situations, I also share that experience. In retrospect I see that I needed my mom more during Jr and Highschool than I did during elementary. I hate that I left home after graduation. Leaving home early and being so far from home nearly ruined my life. I don’t blame my parents for that because it was the teachings they instilled in me and the prayers they prayed that kept me from getting totally consumed by the darkness.
I know without shadow or doubt that my saved parents taught me well. They may have been a little too strict which they have apologized for but as a parent I love them so much now for the strictness because I can see why… So even though you do your job, a child can still stray, I only wish my mom had done more to convince me to stay around home instead of letting me make that decision. We talked about that and she admits that she was under that mentality that at 18 you are grown and you fly the nest…. Looking back she has said that her ambitious desires for her to have a better life financially were not in the best interest because I was so green and overprotected I thought everyone was good and Christian. If I had stayed around, I could have worked and stayed home and saved myself a year and half of pure hell. I came home at 20 and stayed home for a year working and attending community college. I went to a college where her cousin taught and he and his family looked out for me. By the time I entered the university I was used to living on my own and working so I was more mature. But that first year on my own still haunts me, I still am scarred, and it changed my life forever……
Mrs. A,
A widowed (hence single mother) is a different matter and I totally understand the need to work under such circumstances.
Thanks for your comment.
Jamala,
Your situation and others similar are why I felt the need to break this into two parts. I don’t want to get ahead of myself too much here, but I tried (I hope) to present a balanced perspective.
However, I cannot pretend, and neither should any of us, that we don’t all know women who openly confess that they refuse to be at home because they’d be bored, they like shopping too much, they couldn’t stand being with their kids every day all day,etc.
I have even heard women say that they don’t want to put themselves in a vulnerable position in relation to their husband so that he knows they are fully capable of providing for themselves if need be. And yes, I’m talking about Christian women!
As for the status of young adult children, I agree with all of you! My parents don’t ask me for much because they know my hands are full already, but when they do, I try to honore their requests.
You all made excellent points.
And now I’m off until (hopefully) tomorrow!
I just started reading here and enjoy your blog very much,Teri.I would like to add something that I don’t think has been touched upon. I believe that young ladies,in this world,are more vulnerable than young men even though they don’t always realize it. At 18,under no circumstances unless getting married should they be forced out the door. Young men really should be encouraged to become more self reliant,earlier than girls.To me,this is just common sense.Thanks.take care.
I’d also like to add that just because something is law,That doesn’t necessarily make it moral,as I’m sure everyone here already knows.
I think everyone here would agree with you on that point Maryann. I certainly do as does my husband which is why I mentioned our girls remaining at homein the body of the post.
Just because something is legal doesn’tmake it right, but we are still required by law to free our children if they insist on being freed at age 18. I think that was the point some ladies were attempting to make.
Personally,while I agree that girls are more vulnerable, I also think it is important to teach young women a measure of self-reliance as well. Not all women will marry and even among those who do, there are challenges of husbands with disabilities, widowhood, etc. We do our girls a grave disservice, in my opinion when we take no steps to teach them to take care of themselves.
Thankfully, my daugters are in no hurry to leave and often express their desire to stay here as long as possible. We look forward to more years with our daughters beyond the age of 18 unless they marry.
Sadly, I used to think like that and was that woman… Oh but how God is so smart, that he knew how to change my line of thought by forcing me to come home, not for a few months but almost two years…. He made sure that I knew how selfish my thinking was….
And that is exactly what it is…. SELFISH, to want to work only so that you can get a break from your children, or to show the head of your home that you can do without him… And we wonder why so many churches have Divorce outreach….
I have known many a pastor who has had to go minister alone because his wife was at work and not by his side…. that thought alone is scary…. But as you so eloquently mentioned already there are so many variables to this equation but the largest denominator of them all is plain old selfishness!
One of the things I find so interesting about this topic is that the majority of young Christian moms that I know who opt to go back to full-time work don’t even consider that there is an alternative. I completely understand that some moms are (unfortunately) in a position where their income is necessary for survival, but I, too, see very few instances of this in folks around me. When I’ve asked a few new moms if they intend on returning to work, the answer has almost always been, “Of course!”. I wonder if a lot of women find themselves in the same position – not even considering that staying home is a viable option?
I once heard a testimony from one lady who said that, through various circumstances, she felt convinced that the Lord was calling her to put her two small children in daycare and return to work/school full-time while she pursued a graduate degree. And not to say that that was not God’s will, but the idea of that made me a bit uncomfortable as it essentially boiled down to the fact that the mental stimulation she received through school overrode the need of her small children to be at home with her.
I guess,in my experience,I’ve just seen a lot of women,maybe not meaning to,rationalize going back to work by saying that their children no longer need them,they need to learn to be more independent,ect. I guess I’ve also never met a married woman who had to work,although,I’m sure there are a few.People used to use the arguement that homeschoolers wouldn’t learn to be independent but Mostly,that’s not the case from what I’ve seen,either.
I guess I probably got mixed up a bit in my commenting.I have a relative who has a phd. and always made it clear that staying home was beneath her,until recently. Now at 40,she has many regrets. also another relative who thinks she should work in order to be a good role model to her daughters.You know,to teach them self reliance and what not but they always have lots of extra money to do this and that.Well,the sad thing is,you could never offer advice to them or try to help them see,because of pride. (not that I don’t have my own faults)there are very few women who will not get offended by it,even when they ask for your advice(so I usually just keep my mouth shut)
As far as teaching self reliance goes,You really don’t have to live thousands of miles from home to learn that.I know that if a child (female)demanded to leave home at 18yrs. there’s nothing I could do to stop it but in today’s world,I would strongly discourage it. We would also want to have a close relationship with her future spouse(before marriage) to build trust.It is really all about relationship with God and those you love and I wouldn’t want to be distracted by a job(unless absolutely necessary.
Jamala in response to your comment about grown children obeying their parents I don’t feel it is sinful for you if you choose to obey your mother on certain issues. However, you are a married woman and the Bible is clear we are to leave and to cleave to our husbands. We are to first obey our Lord and then submit to the will of our husbands. My mother is a godly woman who will sometimes offer advice, she lives around the corner from me so we see each other daily. She is proud of me and my family and feels that her role as the mother of a forty-three year old Christian wife and mother is advisory. She does not expect me to obey her nor does she make commands. An adult obeys the Lord and seeks guidance from other adults whom they trust and respect.
If for some reason you feel the need to obey your mother in certain areas that is between the Lord, you and your husband. I don’t see it as sin but I also don’t see in Scripture where that is the model for adult children. Hope that clears things up a bit.
To chime in here on this topic of working when your kids are in school, I wonder if it isn’t a case of right or wrong… certainly if you are home when your children are, then that takes care of thei child care issue.
However, I just wonder if as a society in general we have lost a lot from women being in the workplace and tied to an employer’s schedule. Women used to spend the free time they had once their children got older for ministry or volunteer service in the community. Women really had an important impact on the church and other charitable venues in the community, and I think we have lost a lot of that. Think of how stronger our outreach ministries could be at our churches, or any number of other ministries, if women of school-aged children were free to contribute during the week? I know I look forward, Lord willing, to be able to make good use of my time asa minister of Christ in the church and the community once my kids are a bit older (whether I homeschool or not, as it could be greata learning opportunities for them if I do).
So it may not be an issue of right or wrong, I just wonder if it’s the ‘best’. Just my two cents.
Just wanted to say, Shelly, I TOTALLY get where you are coming from here. I know a number of girlfriends who are able to stay at home and help keep their family afloat financially by babysitting other children during the day. I have been encouraged by many to seek this route at some point as a way to supplement my husband’s income and still stay home.
And while the idea is a nice one, I too have the same reservations you have with encouraging a mom to be away from her child and facilitating that, and even making money on it. OF COURSe it’s a totally different situation if you rae doing it as a ministry to someone who is in need, but to make a profit off a career mom… I don’t think I could do that.
And the church daycare is a tricky one, too…I know some churches look at it as an outreach, as they keep their costs low and service mostly non-believing families and hope to draw them to the church in that way, and I can understand the heart there. But it’s a tricky one, and a hard one to discern what is right.
Nicole, I agree with you so much on this point!! I could go on and on about the how’s and why’s of why you make so much sense, but I’ll let your comment speak for itself.
Your two cents are welcome here, friend.
Four more weeks till baby arrives, right?
Kari,
Just wanted to say I think yo make an excellent point, one I have observed over and over, both in and out of the church. It amazes me today how many women just assume they have to go back to work, that there is ‘no choice’. Whether it be because of some societal expectation that staying home ‘isn’t enough’, or if they assume they need to financially (even if they took a good look they would discover they didn’t), it is so incredibly common.
I am 34 weeks pregnant and about to be a stay at home wife and mom for the first time, and I can’t believe how many comments I’ve already had from other women my age who are in a similar pla ein life who say things like, ‘oh it must be so nice for you to be able to stay home, I have to go back to work’. Meanwhile, I see on facebook they aretaking their third high-price vacation, remodeling their kitchen with all new gizmos, buying a second SUV, whatever the case may be. I think these ladies truly and honestly might WANT to stay home if asked, but it doesn’t occur to them that you can actually, gasp, cut back on your standard of living and life is still worth living, and be home with your children.
Satan has done a fabulous job of making a whole new standard in our society that required women to be truly counter-cultural in order to stay home with her children. Not only are financial sacrifices required that are not considered “the norm” (what, no second vehicle? No expensive vacations? No Cable of cell phone????), but just the very idea that a woman is dong ‘enough’ by staying home is something many women have to be strong in order to embrace.
And ultimately, the sad thing is that Satan has won over the men on this issue, too. I know many women who would probably stay home if their men valued it, but as they do not, they continue to work.
Good discussion, ladies!
Thanks, Terry!
Technically it’s five and a half weeks until my due date. But if you’ve got a prophesy it’s only four hey i’d love to hear that, girl! Haha…
Blessings!
It would not surprise me if my general acquaintances did think I worked just because I wanted to. I was raised that it is rude to talk very much about money, and therefore I don’t really go around explaning to everyone why I work (and I don’t wish others to think badly of my husband for not making enough money for me to stay home).
I am grateful for the babysitting services of a SAHM, but I also don’t feel any judgement from her, and don’t think the arrangement would have worked out nearly so well if I did.
I would hope that we as stay-at-home Christian women are not putting ourselves in the position of being the “working mom police.” We really should not concern ourselves with trying to determine if another mother “needs” to work or simply wants to. Is that not between she, her husand and her Lord? Also might we be making the wrong assumptions? Suppose like Nurse Bee a woman wants to protect her husband by not stating that she must work to make ends meet. Quite frankly if I was in Nurse Bee’s position I would not be forthcoming with that information as I know it would hurt my husband. It is his greatest desire that I stay home and we homeschool. If he were to loose his job or become underemployed it would be quite hard for him and I would not broadcast that information to all of our friends and extended family.
Sometimes we simply do not know or understand the complexity of another person’s circumstances. Perhaps that is why we are told not to judge. Only the Lord may judge, which is right because only He sees the complete and total picture.
As for me I think I will keep my focus on my own household as I allow God to lead my husband and I. I will pray that others also follow His lead while I mind my own business realizing that I have no idea what goes on in the homes and hearts of others.
Taunya and Nurse Bee,
I need to make something perfectly clear. Much of what I know about the working mothers I talk to is not because I am the “working mother police.” In fact, until I became a SAHM, I assumed that every woman who worked needed to work. I certainly thought that I needed to, until my husband pointed out that I just thought it because I never bothered to consider another way.
It is the condemnation, curiosity, and questions I have received from working mothers and their own testimonies that ever caused me to realize that there were women who worked because they wanted to rather than needed to. I wasn’t even a believer when I first came home and what the Bible had to say about it was never a factor. Though my salvation and search of the Scripture has certainly turned my heart towards home in ways I never thought possible.
While I have firm convictions, many of which I believe are Biblical, I have taken great pains never to strike a judgmental tone when I say simply what I believe is true. Are we saying that it is wrong to simply present the Scriptures, as I have done, and ask whether we should at least try to live up to it?
Heaven help us if, in our earnest attempt to remain non-judgmental and humble ( and I have more than enough faults to keep me from being puffed up), we take the position that we have to shy away from the truth.
The truth hits us all between the eyes from time to time, doesn’t it? The Scripture is full of references to how we are to relate to one another. First and foremost, we are to loveone another. Weare to bearwith one another, we are to forgiveone another. And we are to exhort, encourage, and spur one another on to good works according to the word. While I am aware of the fact that we cannot all, in any area of life, walk a perfect walk, when we decide that we are going to just mind our own business and never even call fellow believers to attempt to strive for the good rather than the good enough I believe we are wrong.
How do you feel about stay at home dads. This is happening more and more often, for various reasons. My husband and I always said from the very beginning that we wanted one of us to stay home with the kids. It just so happened that it made the most sense for me to be the one to stay home, but if it had been the other way around, neither one of us would have had a problem with him staying home. I know some men are not ready or cut out for full time stay at home parenting, but I think my husband would have done well with it.
Heather, my initial thought is that on a temporary basis, to get through a rough patch when only mom can find work, then yes. You do what you have to do and Dad can stay home.
The experiences I’ve had witnessing families where Dad stayed home for an extended period of time was by and large disastrous. I don’t think men are cut out for being stay at home dads. I know that statement is one that many people vehemently disagree with, but I think a man needs to feel accomplished outside of the walls of his home.
That, however, is just my personal opinion. I am open to the fact that I could be wrong. My husband could do it if it was a temporary thing, but not long term unless he just had to, and it would take much prayer for him to be at peace with me being the breadwinner.
Terry I do not believe it is wrong to present Scriptures concerning women and their roles as mothers and wives in the home. What does worry me is the assumptions we make about others when we say we “know” a woman is working because she chooses to. We may think we know but unless she is coming to us with her complete financial picture, taxes, income, expenses, debt we really don’t know for sure.
I just think Nurse Bee makes a good point when she says those around her probably think she works because she wants to. She purposely does not broadcast the truth to protect her husband. We simply do not know the circumstances of others. So while I can say that I know for certain, and I do, that MANY women work because they want to. I can not in most cases begin to talk about my friends and neighbors and make that judgement. There could be much I don’t know, much they don’t choose to share with me. All I can do is pray that they will follow the Lord’s direction in their lives and if they are choosing work over family that the Holy Spirit would convict.
Does that make sense? I am not saying that you personally have done this but many times we as SAHM’s want to mention the friend, relative, neighbor or lady at church we know who just chooses to work. I have done this myself and I wonder how many times I have said this about someone like Nurse Bee who simply does not want to air the specifics of her family’s financial picture to the world so quietly goes to work while praying for an opportunity to stay home.
Stick around for part 2, Taunya. I’m getting to it, lol.
Pingback: Is Working Compatible With Biblical Womanhood? Pt. 2 « Breathing Grace
I think it is probably wise to ask the older folks (or anyone over 40)how things have changed and they’re assessment on cultural changes that have occurred in the past few years. Most of these people have seen the dramatic changes in family life and the views of women. If we aren’t holding one another accountable I guess we could just turn the whole thing over to the government which is where it’s headed anyhow.When I was young,a man had to be almost flat on his back for a woman to feel justified in leaving her children with people that weren’t relatives to work.I think that when a relative I’ve known for twenty years tells me they’d rather work for personal fullfillment than be with their children than I can discern where they’re coming from. Not trying to be arguementative,just getting tired of the old (judging someone is worse than the sin the person is committing especially when they tell you about it and want your opinion)
Mary Ann being that I am over 40 and therefore older (smile) I will weigh in. But first I must apologize to Terry for commenting so much on this post. Normally I don’t comment or only comment once even though I am a regular reader and have been for a long while.
Yes I have seen many changes in our society concerning the role of women. Your last sentence though is key when someone comes to you and tells you their circumstances and asks your opinion you 100% should give them the truth in a loving manner using Scripture to back up what you are saying. You should never hold back or mince words for fear of offending someone. If you are speaking the truth and you do so in love, and if the person has come to you with the details or their situation you are doing the right thing to share what the Bible says about the role of a wife and mother.
The problem comes in only when we make a judgement without having all of the facts or when we think we have them because we “see”certain things. At that point we have crossed a line. For example, if I see a mother at my church working and living in a nice neighborhood I may assume she is working to afford a luxury home when she could move to a smaller one and stay home. That is an assumption though as I don’t know the all of the facts. There may be things about this couple and their finances that I know nothing of.
The correct way to handle things in my opinion would be to one, approach the lady and ask her about her circumstances if I felt my relationship with her would support that. Or two, just pray that the Holy Spirit would convict if I do not feel that I have established enough of a relationship with her to ask.
The wrong thing to do would be to assume she was selfish and in sin without first trying to obtain all of the facts.
We are called to hold one another accountable and we should whenever possible. Hopefully we are all ready, willing and able to talk to any woman who comes to us for advice and are looking for ways to develop relationships with others so they feel comfortable opening up and sharing their hearts with us.
The key here is love and not condemnation, love and seeking to understand. Not hiding from the truth, not keeping quiet for fear of offending but knowing when and how to speak and also knowing when it is time to be quiet and take it to the Lord in prayer.
Okay Terry I will not comment further on this one, sorry!!!
Thanks for that Henderson.I’ve just found that Christians striving to live Godly lives sometimes come across as being judgemental when they don’t even say anything. We are different,which the bible corraborates,and so can come across condemming when not meaning to be.Assumptions are made both ways which is why I’ve found relationships with women can be strained unless the relationship is a superficial one which at this point is where I prefer it to be.God be with you,Mary Ann
Regarding the above comment,I will still seek to love my neighbor as myself even when it’s difficult.It’s easy for us to love those who love us,this I know.
Terry, I am wondering – what about situations when the husband chooses to stay at home while the wife works? So, there is still a parent in the home, to answer your question about sending children off to be raised by others. Does it have to be the wife?
Also, what if a grandmother or an aunt or other relative is the one supplying the child care? I understand it still isn’t the parents (and I agree that raising a child, is most definitely, the parent’s responsibility, Biblically speaking), but at least it is a trusted family member with similar values.
Just some things I’ve run into and wondered about myself… so I thought I’d see your thoughts!
Excellent post, btw.
Thanks for you thoughts. I too have seen instances when it did not work out at all, in fact caused more problems then it solved. However I have also seen instances when it was a great situation and everybody benefited. Honestly I think it all comes down to the fact that we are all different people, because that is the way God made us, and what works for one may not work for another. The husband and wife def. have to be on the same page.
I agree that not many men, especially those in the conservative Christian world, would have trouble with their wives being the breadwinner. Thanks again.
Erin,
I asked much the same question.
I have to think that in a situation where the mother is working, for whatever reason, it has to be better to have the child with his/her father, trusted family member or friend, than to have them in a large cooperate type day care.
Mrs. H,
You are so correct. I only meant instances like when I am at her home, or if I am running an errand for her or something like that… I take her advice and pray about it but if she asked me to something for her while in her presence ie,… can you fix me a drink or bring me something back. those types of things. LOL but then again I love taking care of my momma and daddy!
I side with Proverbs 31. A virtuous woman is gifted and equipped to manage home, work, husband and family. This woman is also prudent, strong, up late and rises early, she is industrious, entrepreneurial, a visionary . . . She is no ordinary woman. She wasn’t raised on TV and romance novels. She is woman who probably learned to work running a business and a home along side an equally awesome hardworking brilliant woman.
How many woman today can say they were mentally, physically, intellectually trained for that kind of life. We have grown up dependant on compulsory education and molded to fit into a job created for us outside of the home like a square peg being whittled away to fit into a round whole. We are trained to think outside the home. We are not prepared to think like entrepreneurs we are not trained think creatively and create jobs for ourselves. We grow up preparing ourselves for “work” that is given to us instead of work we create for ourselves. So when a wife and mother needs money and has to help with the family finances naturally she must think in the home or out. Unless she turns to packaged work at home scheme or pyramid sales job selling things she didn’t create, hoping for a small percentage of the profit for a lot of work and time.
We need to rediscover the skills we lost. We need to tap into our own creativity and develop our minds. I press toward this mark and I try to encourage my children to get education, get prepared for life but then think outside the box. I want them to all tap into their talents, their skills and find ways they can earn a living without asking for a job. Interesting discussion, lots of different schools of thought. As always Terry you have a way of making us really think!